Note: This transcript was auto generated then some poor soul sat and listened to it, and followed through correcting any mistakes they spotted. Please however expect human error and shout if you spot an issue. Email: lee [fancy curly symbol] trailblazer.fm.
Verbatim text
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Hi and welcome to the WP Innovator podcast, the WordPress podcast for design and web agencies. Let’s make WordPress work for your business.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Hi and welcome to the WP Innovator Podcast. This is your host, Lee Jackson. And today we have for you episode 22. So you know what that means. We have been rocking and rolling for 22 weeks. That’s a little bit insane. And I’m telling you, There are another 22 weeks of a really exciting content to come. Now, I’m in an amazing position right now because I’ve already heard some of the up and coming episodes because, man, I was a part of them and there is so much value and so
Lee Matthew Jackson:
much knowledge coming up.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
I’m just so excited. So today our visitor is Mike Doyle. Mike Doyle is an amazing guy who specializes in online animation. So I’m not going to spoil it too much, but you seriously need to listen to this episode. He’s been in business for a long time and he’s learned a lot. So it’s great to hear how his animation agency has gone from him being a freelancer right through to being a fully fledged business. Listening to the challenges and also learning how he niched right down into animation when there were so other different distractions, different routes that he could have gone. He could have been an all things to all men and yet he went right down to video animation.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Absolutely fantastic story. So before we carry on, we’d love to chat to you over on the private Facebook group. Just head on over to Facebook and type in WP Innovator. You’ll find us there in the group. Or head on over to leejacksondev.com group. The group is growing by a few extra listeners every week and it’s so cool to develop a new online community full of web designers, web developers and business people who are all helping each other out and chatting, asking questions and learning how to grow their businesses together. So head on over. That’s leejacksondev.com group.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
I’m going to shut up.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
You’re going to enjoy. Hi, this is your host, Lee, and I’m really pleased to introduce you to Mike Doyle. He is a content creator and the CEO and director and master of all he surveys at Drive 80 Drive at are a content creator. They specialize in animated content. And mate, I am super pleased to have you say hello. Hello, hello. Hey, mate, tell us a little bit about you. Kind of fill in the gaps of my introduction there and just give us a bit of background about who is the Mike Doyle?
Mike Doyle:
Well, what would benefit your question? I could go into personal stuff. I could talk about business stuff. So what would be more of a direct answer that would be helpful?
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Oh, no.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Well, we want to know about you first of all. So give us a background. Where do you hail from? How old are you? Obviously 20 or something like that. Because you look young on your pictures. Just creeping up to you now and a little bit of kind of what drives you. What are your hobbies and stuff like that. Let’s get to know Mike before we get into business.
Mike Doyle:
Okay. My name is Mike Doyle. I live currently in Raleigh, North Carolina, in the States. I’m actually turning 37.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
No.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, I get that a lot. People are like, wow, you look so much younger. I’m like, yeah, it’s.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
I kind of don’t like you right now.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, I’ll meet people in their late 20s and they look like they’re like 50 years old. And I’m always like, good God, man. You should probably work out a little bit and eat some vegetables. Yeah. So personal stuff, I’m really. I’m big into creating stuff that kind of drives me. So I live every day and if I don’t create something, I feel like I haven’t really kind of lived a full day, which is also kind of the bane of my existence because if you don’t feel fulfilled and you’re going to bed, it starts driving you nuts. But creatively, I’m huge into writing music, I’m big into cooking.
Mike Doyle:
I like photography. Animation is just one of the many things I love doing. I’m big into video shooting. So again, anything that’s fun and creating, I’m a huge fan of. I’m gonna say I’m a lot. So you probably edit that out.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
That’s cool.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, just again, fun. Be 37 single. That’s right.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Ladies, if you’re listening.
Mike Doyle:
Ladies, if you’re listening.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
37 year old who looks like he’s in his 20s, who looks like he’s in his twenties and needs to have at least one creative moment a day to feel fulfilled. If you match this criteria.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, driveab.com. that’s good.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Hey, mate, if anything happens of this as well, I’d like to be best man.
Mike Doyle:
No promises. You have to buy the ticket to fly over here.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Yeah, sure, sure. That’s cool.
Mike Doyle:
Actually, just a side note, last year, which was kind of a fun thing I did. Well, not really fun, I had some personal stuff that went down and I sold everything and started traveling the United States for about seven months, which was really fun And I got to really learn a lot about myself and my business is remote, which was helpful in doing this. So I suggest to anyone who is living a very. Anyone who’s having a hard time in life is questioning doing something drastic. I say just do it because it was life changing and it was really amazing.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
It’s really funny you should mention that because we’ve had a couple of entrepreneurs now on who’ve both done something very similar. One comes to mind would be Matt Newton. He. He did exactly that. And he’s essentially, he’s from Australia, but he’s traveled the world. He’s now based in Chile where he settled down there, he’s got his business running out there, etc. But he did exactly the same, ended up all over the world. Because it’s a mobile business.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
As long as you got your laptop and a bit of WI fi somewhere, you’re good to go. Really?
Mike Doyle:
That’s it.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
And he’s done exactly that. And he’s had so many adventures along the way. Yeah.
Mike Doyle:
That’s amazing. I would love to do the world traveling. I’m so jealous of that.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Well, I’m just jealous you get to go around America all the time. I mean, for us over here in the uk, we just kind of wish England was like America.
Mike Doyle:
Really?
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Yeah, of course we do. We think you guys are awesome. You didn’t know?
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, no, I think that Europe is like the Mecca of where travel should be. The United States is great, but it’s a lot of places. It’s very cookie cutter and very. It’s the same thing, you know, unless you go into the mountains and you know, I was in Portland and I was. The drive up the California coast was unbelievable. But so there are some cool spots. But I just see Europe is just being the, you know, life changing experience.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Cool, isn’t it? I mean, we take what we’ve got for granted over here, I guess as well. Like, you know, it’s same old, same old for us. We like the experience of being out there in America and seeing those different things and we find that cookie cutter sort of thing quite fascinating as well.
Mike Doyle:
Wow.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Yeah, it’s weird. And yeah, again, I mean, I get the same from quite a lot of Americans who come over here. They especially love the older buildings except, oh my God, the higgledy biggledy streets and everything.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
They love it.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Amazing.
Mike Doyle:
It’s just, you just feel that everything’s old there, which is just got just, you know, essence to it. I think that’s amazing.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Well, if you ever need a Place to stay, mate. Just. Just give me a call.
Mike Doyle:
Cool.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Cool. Nice one. Well, that’s. That’s really exciting. Let’s. Could you just kind of give us a quick introduction to what Drive 80 does now as well? So we’ll switch from kind of personal. You sound awes are or someone. We’ve known you for a long time now.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
It feels like a long time. But let’s find out. What is Drive 80 all about?
Mike Doyle:
Drive 80 is all about creating content for people to stand out. And I try to push the boundaries with what we do. None of the work you really see that we have, I’d say would be very extreme, but we like to add a sarcastic and humorous tone to what we’re doing in our animation. So we create animated content. We don’t do video production, we don’t do logos, we don’t do print design. These are things we did in the past. And I realized that to become niche down was a lot more focused and helped me get through my day a lot easier because my head wasn’t everywhere. So, yeah, if you have a company that is struggling to stand apart from your competition or you’re frustrated that people just don’t get what you do, we use animated storytelling to simplify your message so people can understand how you can help them.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
You can see some really good examples as well over at drive80.com epic we’ll talk more about that later. But if you want to see the sort of work that Mike and his team are doing, head over now to drive80.com epic and we’re going to make sure there’s some show notes in there. Now, Mike, I remember a while back you offered me a free video, which was pretty darn awesome. You created one which explained what we. And what we do is we take a design and we’ll code it, and you create a really cool animated graphic that we still use to this very day on Twitter, which is about 12 seconds long. And it quite literally says you design it, we code it, and it’s got a really nice animation with some HTML tags on there, et cetera. And it’s just really plain and simple. So this is the sort of thing that Mike is talking about.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Real simple, nicely designed, cleverly animated, sometimes with some good humor in there. Animations that kind of catch the eye, especially on social media, love that sort of thing, you know, catch the eye and within a few seconds, even without the necessary need of sound, because obviously we all know Twitter doesn’t play sound automatically, but it does start playing your video you know, within a few seconds, people can get a real quick idea of what that particular message is all about. So that was one of the reasons why I wanted to get you on the podcast, really, because it’s something I’ve not really seen before, I gotta be honest. Yeah, we’ve seen the long 2 or 3 minute explainer videos with a this is Bob, which I’m sure you also do.
Mike Doyle:
We do that as well. Yeah, that’s what we started doing. And those are a lot more in depth, bigger budget and stuff. But the smaller stuff like we’ve done, like the Drybaddy Epic stuff is more of the very short Instagram, Twitter, Facebook videos. So yeah, we do both.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Exactly. And it really did appeal to me and hence why we then subscribed to your Epic offer. Again, we’ll go into that, into more detail. But it. If you head over to drive80.comepic you’ll see all that there and obviously drive80.com to see some of the examples. The other thing I like about your model mate is that you’re really niching down. So you said you did a bit of everything, but now you’ve niched right down. John Lee Dumas says niche until it hurts.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
And I really like that you’ve niched right down to something. You do it really well. You’re focused on just that. You don’t have the, the complication of trying to do a manager, print run or anything else like that. You can just do what you do best. And I love that. And we’ve talked about that quite a few times already on the podcast with different guests, you know, really niching down. So high five to you, mate.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
How long have you guys been going now?
Mike Doyle:
We actually just. LinkedIn just said we had our five year anniversary the other day, which was crazy. Yeah, I mean, I established, I used to freelance for six years before I even started the company. And I had been through business partnerships and different ideas and drive 80 was just. Well, I had broken up this business partnership with another guy and I was like, you know, I realized how to create an llc, so why don’t I do that when I’m freelancing and I can utilize a federal ID number instead so I look more professional. And when I did that, within that year I started establishing. I started off doing everything and started niching it down where I was like, you know what, let me just cut out all the crap that is just killing my day and do just animation and do it till it hurts. Because everyone was like, you shouldn’t do that you shouldn’t do that.
Mike Doyle:
And when I did it, they were like, wow, you actually made it happen. And so within. So five years ago, that first year was just that experiment of going with my gut, you know, feeling what felt right, and then what was bringing in money and what. What made my day feel better where I wasn’t so stressed out. So, yeah, five years of figuring all that out.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
And before we get into the other questions, I am intrigued. What’s the story behind the name Drive 80?
Mike Doyle:
I’m a big fan. So I used to be in a band when I was 17. And what we always established when we were. I was in many bands when I was younger. When we were in our one band, we were called Lane Meyer, and we were this pop punk band from Jersey. And our rule of thumb was, if you could say the name of the band to your mom without feeling embarrassed, that was the name you should stick with. And I’ve always stuck with that throughout my life. So pretty much every business I do, I’m always trying to recreate the style of what it feels like being in a band, in a business.
Mike Doyle:
So I take that with me. So one day I was like, all right, well, I broke up this business partnership, or we broke the partnership up. I need a new name. But I have to use the old theory of, well, if I say this to my mom, will I feel embarrassed by it? I got in my car and started driving on the road. And what I used to do is just crank. I’m huge into metal and, you know, really loud noise that makes you, like, angry and pumped up. So I got in my car and started blasting Dillinger escape plan. And I was driving on.
Mike Doyle:
I was like, I’m just gonna go for. I’m gonna go watch the movie. That’s what I do in the summer. I just go see blockbusters all the time. And I just go for a drive there to get away from the day. And I was driving to a movie, and we have this highway in America in the states that goes from New York City all the way to San Francisco, and it’s Route 80. So I was literally driving on Route 80, and I’m like, holy crap. I’m drive 80.
Mike Doyle:
That just flows. It rolls off the tongue. It works. It doesn’t describe what animation is, but I figured that I like a lot of businesses that their product makes the name a product, a brand. Instead of the name being, like, animation company in New Jersey, it just sounds so Bland. But Drive 80, it becomes something like, oh, people say, like, Drive 80. That’s animation. So, yeah.
Mike Doyle:
And then people were like, oh, let’s do it. So you’re just driving on Rudy and they’re like, yeah, they’re like, yeah, but it should be, you know, you drive, drive faster in your company. And you know, my buddy came up with the tagline acceleration through animation. And so I was like, that sounds cooler. But the true story is I was just driving on the road and the road I was on, that was pretty much it. But the one thing was another thing too is, you know, I’m talking a lot, but the. I was, I was thinking of a way that people across the country could connect with the name as well. And I figured since Route 80 went across the entire country, people say, oh yeah, I’ve driven on Route 80.
Mike Doyle:
So there’s that initial connection of comfort. So that was another part of it.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
So there’s a lot more thought actually as you unpack it. It’s actually quite deep. I’m impressed. Yeah, yeah. So I live on a road called the A6.
Mike Doyle:
Okay.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
It’s not quite.
Mike Doyle:
So see, I think that would be pretty, you know, be like the A6. I think that would be a cool band name.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
A6. Yeah. Yeah. It’s also a car name though, isn’t it? The Audi A6.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah. I don’t really know cars well.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Moving on, mate. So five years plus six years of freelancing. Thinking back over all those years, what do you rating has been the biggest challenge in your business?
Mike Doyle:
Understanding business, you know, understanding that when you just create something cool doesn’t mean everyone wants to buy it. And when you start your own business doesn’t mean you’re actually going to do what your profession is. And that’s a really. You have to wear a lot of hats, which no one understands. But the moment you get into your own business, the structure of that everyone feels gets thrown in your lap right away. And that’s a hard thing to swallow. So you have to have a lot of determination and you have to stick with it because people will be like, oh, I want to start. You know, I make pies really well.
Mike Doyle:
So I want to start a pie shop. I’m going to bake pies. And then they don’t realize that, you know, there goes your weekends and there goes your nights. And then you have. Then it’s like, okay, well you great create great pies. But who’s buying them? You know, do they like cherry, do they like apple? Then you’re like, well, I make all the brands. Like, well, no, apple sells more. And you’re better at making that and people buy more of that.
Mike Doyle:
So you should just niche down and do that. But. But where do you go? Where do you go to sell them? So all of these variables come about, and I think that’s the hardest thing about starting a business is learning all that stuff and being open to accepting that. Because I think people are really. When it’s their own business, it’s very personal. And you get very offended when someone gives you advice that’s not yours or you’re telling you that what you’re doing is wrong. And you have to be open to accepting that. And I still have problems to this day.
Mike Doyle:
If someone tells me something I’m doing looks bad or shitty, I get really offended. I’m like, you know, I’m sorry, I just swear. But like, you know, you know, I’m like, go f yourself. This is my baby. But you have to be open to taking in what they’re telling you because other people might feel the same way and it might be grow. It might help you grow your business.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Yeah. So I totally get you. And with regards to kind of that idea, a lot of us started as. I think it’s the book called E Myth. We kind of start as technicians. We are able to do the actual work, that is create the pie or create the animation or build the website. But there’s all those extra skills that are so hard to learn, isn’t it? You know, sales, keeping your eye on your sales pipeline, kind of managing processes, procedures. And that is such a huge thing to kind of just hit straight on, I guess, as well.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Before Drive 80 though, you had kind of that experience over the six years of freelancing as well. That kind of give you a taster of what was to come for the. For the actual launch of Drive80 itself.
Mike Doyle:
A little bit. A little bit. You know, it was. Because when you freelance, you’re showing up at an office and all you have to do is the project that’s put in front of you. So you don’t have to worry about selling it, you don’t have to worry about distributing it. My job was create this graphic, make this video, edit, or make this animation, you know, okay.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
So the freelancer was more kind of on job rather than kind of freelancing specific products out to people. It was more. It was a time at places.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, it was a mix because I had. I would be freelancing on site at a place. So I was smart enough to know that, okay, if I’m working Monday through Friday at this place on Site from, you know, nine in the morning till four in the afternoon. Or, you know, I did that for about a year and a half and I was like, okay, this is a sweet gigs. I was paying, getting paid, stupid money, like really good. And then after that they’re like, well, let’s cut you down. We want to cut you back your hours. I’ll work three days a week.
Mike Doyle:
And then the other two days I was doing what, websites and things like that. So that stuff was word of mouth. So I had that fluff and that padding from the freelancing on site to just be like, oh, I don’t have to really go crazy. But when I didn’t have that and I went completely on my own, that’s when it was, oh, wait, I need to get clients.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
It’s funny, isn’t it, that kind of, that final push. If people are kind of doing half and half, you’re half doing a job and you’re half running a business. You don’t have that pressure, do you? But then suddenly when you, you, your main breadwinner is the business, you suddenly find you’re actually able to do those cold calls or go out to that networking meeting, etc. And I definitely found that I’ve kind of had a similar growth pattern to yourself where I started off freelancing and then had a job for a while because freelancing wasn’t paying, and then went back into freelancing and then kind of slowly slipped into business. But then one day realized I had to make that cut and just do it. I had kids to feed, the rent to pay. It’s like, oh, crap, I actually have to do this now.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah. And that fire gets lit under your butt and it’s, you know, you only have a choice is to figure out how to bring money in so you can. In that crossroad, it’s, do you stick with this and hope that it works, or do you go try to find a job and then hope that you can find the one you want?
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Yeah.
Mike Doyle:
So, you know, it’s not just an easy decision. I’ll just get a job. Well, you know, how are you going to get that job? Are you going to market yourself to
Lee Matthew Jackson:
get the job just as hard? Yeah, yeah, exactly. So is there any kind of one, like an idea or something that happens? You said like you struggled in the early days kind of understanding business in general. Was there kind of like a moment where maybe you read a book or had some sort of idea that enabled you to make a big shift in the business? That you can think back to.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah. What really helped was I was freelancing, and I had enough work up until May of 2011. And so January 1st was it. Yeah. I forget times. I can’t remember January. I went, you’re getting old, mate.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
So you know, I know.
Mike Doyle:
Wait, where am I? Who is this? What am I doing?
Lee Matthew Jackson:
It’s when I start talking extra loud to you, then you know you got a problem. Are you all right, Mike?
Mike Doyle:
Actually, my hearing is going because of listening to loud music for so many years. I have noticed that recently. So I have to keep it at very low decibels. So In January of 2011 or 12, whenever the. The math makes sense, I think it’s 11. I had enough work up until that May. And I noticed when May came, everything dried up. And for an entire summer, I was like, wait a minute, what am I doing? And I had ran.
Mike Doyle:
I luckily ran into someone who ran a business of mastermind groups, which I had never heard of. And I go, look, I heard about this master group, mastermind group thing, or master group, mastermind groups. I was like, I heard of this thing called mastermind groups. Carnegie used to do it, or Carnegie, however people say it. Henry Ford, all these really. These ballers used to get together in a room with these guys and talk about business for hours, and it created growth. I go, I’d love to be as rich as those guys. So I want to join this.
Mike Doyle:
So I ended up joining this group. And every once a month for four hours, eight of us would get together and we would talk about business. We’d get 10 minutes each to talk and talk about our successes and then our challenges. And then you’d shut up, and everyone around the table would give you two minutes of advice, and you just had to write it down. And it was really helpful because, you know, you take so much of it. Again, your business is personal, and you couldn’t challenge what was being thrown at you. It was just accept it and just take the piece that’s going to help you. And I learned about bookkeeping.
Mike Doyle:
I learned about sales. I learned about marketing. I learned that I had to go and network all these things I didn’t know. And then at the same time, the guy, like you said, he gave me the ebook the E. Myth. I hated reading up until that point. The only thing I ever read was, like, the Harry Potter books. And that was like, it.
Mike Doyle:
So I read that book, and that’s, you know, that’s where I got the pie reference like you mentioned. And so life has a way when you want to do something to start throwing the right path in front of you. And some people think it’s all mumbo jumbo and crap, but it’s really true. Think of anything you want to do in life. When you were in high school and you wanted to maybe be in the play or join a band or something like that, you didn’t know how to do it. But all of a sudden, conversations started happening, and then the flyer was up somewhere and there was an opening. All these paths. Open your eyes to, this is how it’s going to happen.
Mike Doyle:
And that’s what happened in business. It was, you want to have this business. You’re saying out loud for months you need help. Well, all of a sudden, help got thrown in front of me, and I took it and went with it. And that was like a big thing that I learned, too. And that was the thing I learned about business. Like, you have to mentally be. It’s a mental game as much as it is strategy.
Mike Doyle:
And the quote unquote, just business stuff. Like, you need a balance. It’s all in this pool. And, you know, if you find that flow, it starts to work. But if one thing’s off, it’s going to just screw everything up.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Kind of reminds me that story. Kind of reminds me of the saying, when the student is ready, the teacher will appear.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, 100. 100%.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Very Mr. Miyagi style. Kind of wax on, wax off statement that.
Mike Doyle:
But yeah, and people. People think that they’re like, oh, that’s so stupid. It’s like, yeah, but you’re probably. If you honestly think that and say that out loud, if you look at your life, you’re probably not in the place you want to be.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Yeah, exactly.
Mike Doyle:
And if you. I was talking to a friend of mine today about this, you know, where she was like, negative people are just such a pain in the ass because they have such snarky comments and they’re all this. And they have just this negative lifestyle. It’s because they’re projecting this crap. And, yeah, I joke around about stuff, too, but I really believe anyone comes to me with an idea or anything that’s involved in business, I’m like, dude, you go for it. You know, follow your gut, do. Do what it takes, and the right things will be put in your way to make it happen. If you’re open to it.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Totally. There’s actually a book I read recently as well. It was kind of unpacking fear, and it was. I think it’s called Feel the Fear and Go for It. Or something along those lines. And the idea behind that as well, you know what you just said, when someone comes to you with a business idea and you’re like, dude, just go for it and let’s see what happens. There’s kind of no such things as a bad idea because it’s, it’s the journey. It’s that journey, isn’t it? It’s the journey to that.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
And if that idea fails or whatever, doesn’t matter, a whole load of awesome stuff will have happened along that journey, which will then potentially shape future decisions, you know, and you could go down a completely different path. So for you, for example, you started off kind of as a, an agency doing all sorts of different things. And then during that journey you found your, you know, your sweet spot, etc. As well. And along the way had like 10 teachers in a room telling you what you needed to do for two minutes whilst you bit your tongue. Yeah, that had been me. You don’t know my business.
Mike Doyle:
I mean, there was times where I was like, go f yourself. You don’t know my business.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
You know, weeping outside. Yeah, man. I’ve actually never been in a mastermind, but I’ve been lucky enough to. I was thrown into a business a few years ago as a, as a shareholder, so kind of had to learn very quickly from the guys in that business. You know, I learned a lot of lessons from those guys on kind of what to do, what not to do, etc. And we were kind of took that journey together, but it was the same sort of thing. I was just launching out in business and then lo and behold, some guys turned up that I could learn from and I’m always going to appreciate that. Just, just amazing.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Kind of reminiscing now, mate. Reminiscent.
Mike Doyle:
Well, you think if you think back to when you wanted to start it, you might have been, I don’t know how to do this. And no one knows how to do anything. From the beginning, if someone starts college, they don’t know how they’re going to get their degree. They just know that they want it. Hopefully they’re going into college with that mindset. If they go in there with a determination of I will become this, then the right things will be put in front of them. It’s anything. Anyone who’s listening this or just think back to anything you’ve done in your life, every time you started it, you most likely had no idea how you do it.
Mike Doyle:
And it just kind of. It didn’t just happen that you had to put effort into it, but the path, it just lights up in front of your face. And everyone could probably pick out like 10 moments in their life where they’re like, holy crap, this guy’s right. And it doesn’t stop. You know, just because you’re in your 20s or 30s doesn’t mean that that learning process stops. I mean, you should be, you’ll be establishing new things for the rest of your life and you have to really be open to that and to having conversations and picking out that aha moment from that conversation. You’re like, oh my God, I can’t believe that just set off this whole new thing for me to do. Or that’s the thing I needed right now.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Yeah, that’s awesome, mate. I kind of feel like I should pause there just to let that sink in. That could even be the snippet I’ll play right at the very beginning of the episode just to whet people’s appetite.
Mike Doyle:
I like it.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
So we always like to throw in a WordPress question. The idea behind the WP Innovator podcast is we have, we do have design agencies listening, web designers, etc. So we like to cover things on WordPress, but also more importantly, we like to talk to people like yourself who run, you know, you’re running a content agency. We like to learn from you guys, learn kind of what makes you take the business journey, your sorts of ideas and the amazing stuff you shared. What would be cool then is obviously you don’t focus on websites like you said as much nowadays, but you do run a few of your own WordPress sites. Before we kind of unpack, and I really want to unpack the epic, the epic video solution that you, that we’re going to talk about. But before we do that, could you just kind of name drop a WordPress plugin that you think you’ve or that you found particularly useful over the years?
Mike Doyle:
I mean the best one, and everyone has this, it’s not really WordPress plugin, but I think the Sumome thing is pretty amazing. But even though it’s just collecting email addresses.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
So do you mean the kind of, the kind of doormat option or the pop up? Because sumome itself, they’ve got a whole range of stuff.
Mike Doyle:
Oh yeah, the pop up, Sumo me pop up. I think that that was a big one that helped me with collecting obviously emails because I didn’t understand that. I’m still learning about that. I thought that was great, but I see that I don’t really know how to answer that question too well because I have such a very basic style with the WordPress. So I just did enough things to get through it.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Well, I think you’ve name dropped a really good application. It’s Sumo me. No one’s actually really talked about it on the podcast before. Anyway, a lot of people do think it’s a given that people know about it. But actually you and me probably know about it because of AppSumo and the guys behind AppSumo, Noah, etc. They’re the people behind it. But Sumo me, there’s a whole range of plugins that will help you grow a list. So Noah Kagan, he is the guy behind AppSumo, he’s got lists, email lists of probably a million people or more.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Super successful.
Mike Doyle:
Here’s the crazy thing, obviously don’t quote me, but when sumome launched and again what it is, it’s you put a piece of code into your WordPress like your header or wherever the code is, the backend area. And you’ll see it on websites. There’s this little blue box that sits on the top the of either left side or the right side and you’ll see it when you get the website. Unless they’re paying for the subscription and you click it. It’s a little crown. But what it is when you get to a website and you’ll probably see this all the time, it’s these pop up windows like you’re pretty awesome. Download this free guide or whatever it is the person’s giving you for free. And I think they said they got onto like a billion or 2 billion websites that year when they launched it, something astronomical.
Mike Doyle:
And again, like I could be way off, but I swear I remember hearing that they got on that many websites,
Lee Matthew Jackson:
the guys are just legends.
Mike Doyle:
I mean he just, Noah Kagan, I mean, I think he’s freaking brilliant. I think that his bedside manner with telling people advice kind of sucks sometimes. And I think that the people that he breeds in the Wanderpreneur group, I think they try to be cocky and I’m not a fan of that style, you know, and maybe it’s burning myself for saying that, but I just think it’s honest. But I think the guy in his, I think if you got him one on one, he’d be freaking awesome to hang out with. But he’s just so freaking smart because he’s like, what is everyone having a hard time with? Getting email, getting emails. Because he’s like, that’s how you grow business. Well, how can they get them? Well, it has to be a form. And this, he’s like, why don’t you just do a pop up? So he does it and then he sees how many people are downloading this thing.
Mike Doyle:
And it was just the. Holy crap. Here’s just another amazing thing that I thought of that’s generating a new business for me.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Yeah, we’ll put. We’ll put the link. What I’ll do is I’m going to put the link to Noah Kagan’s block, which is Okdawk. Also to Sumo me. I’ll put this in the description as well. But that’s such a good name drop there. Hey, with regards to his bedside manner, I think I agree there’s a guy, Gary Vanderchuck, love a lot of the stuff he says, but I also want to punch him a lot as well. So it’s like this kind of love, hate.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
He’s like, do you guys have Marmite over there?
Mike Doyle:
Who is it?
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Marmite? No, maybe you don’t. In the uk, there’s this stuff that is called Marmite and the common expression is you either love it or you hate it. I don’t know if you have, like any product out there that you either love or hate, but Gary Vanderchuck is very much that. For me, it’s a constant battle of I’m never quite sure whether I want to punch him or I want to kiss the guy first. What he’s just said, that’s like.
Mike Doyle:
I actually think Gary Vee is awesome because I love how he just has no filter. And that’s pretty much how I want, like, how I run my stuff. But I think the problem with a lot of people in the spotlight is there’s such douchebags sometimes and everyone is like, all sudden, they just start becoming like that. And you’re like, you don’t even. You’re not even the people who follow them. I’m like, you can’t even make a sale, like, who, who are you to be such a cocky bastard to other people? And it’s just. It annoys the hell out of me. And I think that people like to hide behind their Facebook profiles or their.
Mike Doyle:
Their comments or things like that and just make these snide remarks and stuff. It’s just like, you don’t have enough to back you to make that valuable, you know? And it’s like, why don’t you try to take a positive thing? It’s like, yeah, I’ll mess with people and make sarcastic, you know, comments and just be joking, but never try to hurt someone’s feelings. No, but I just think there’s a Lot of people out there that think the way to become like these guys is just to be a dick.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Exactly. You know, I mean, the thing is though, the people like Gary V. Especially the reason why he upsets me is not because of him. It’s because I realize he’s right and I’m doing something wrong. That’s why I punch the guy.
Mike Doyle:
I know.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
It’s like, stop telling me the truth in such a hard assed way. Could you just say it with a little bit of sugar on there? And it made me feel a bit better.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah. Again, like, I think I love Gary Vee. I especially love it. He’s from New Jersey. He. I think his hustle’s amazing. I think his content’s fantastic. I love his AskGaryVee because it’s really smart stuff.
Mike Doyle:
I’m more. I’m not a fan of the people that try to become like these guys because they, it’s like they’re taking on the personality and they haven’t even accomplished anything yet. And all of a sudden, yeah, yeah. It’s just annoying. It’s like, shut up. You know, just go back to working your job and giving your crappy advice, you know, or your product probably sucks anyway.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Do you feel better now?
Mike Doyle:
I feel so much better, thanks.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Hey, here’s a hug.
Mike Doyle:
Here’s a virtual hug.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
That’s awesome. So, mate, I was really excited the other day. There was this really handsome guy called Mike on Drive 80 video that appeared in my feedback explaining to me that he could give me so many videos a month that I could use for my web agency. So I’m a web agency, I build websites and obviously my clients as well are all web agencies. The listeners are all web agencies. And it kind of blew my mind. Can you just unpack for us what your offer is at the moment with regards to the animation and the videos on a monthly subscription?
Mike Doyle:
Yeah. So a couple months ago I just started to make videos out of graphics I saw online or people said something. I would recreate it as an animation and put it back out there and say, hey, this is what you just said. But I animated it and it just started taking off and getting a lot of attention. And I thought, okay, how can I do this for other people? And then when people come to me, typically they think like, I want an animation and they think it’s going to cost a few hundred bucks and it doesn’t. It costs money. And it’s such a hard balance because I would like to help startups, but they typically never have a budget And I’m like, well what can I give them to get give them some exposure where the business will grow because people are noticing them. And I’m like, well why don’t I just create videos on my own and then put them out there and then sell them for a low cost so people can afford it.
Mike Doyle:
But again, niching down, I had to, I couldn’t just do about. Can’t just do videos on every topic because the right people who are it’s going to help. It’s not targeted to what their needs are. So I found that people who own their own business and either focus on creating marketing plans for their customers or websites for their customers really attached to these things and people who like sarcasm really attached to this stuff. So it kind of like put layers down. And so I was like, let me create this product. And I called it Epic Information Monthly. And Infomation is my play on informative animations.
Mike Doyle:
So Infomation and what Disney esque that
Lee Matthew Jackson:
is, by the way.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, I was like, oh, this is because I used to make when I was doing the animations for people’s topics that I saw or recreating an infographic that was online, I used to call it a fanimation.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Nice.
Mike Doyle:
You know, fan art, fanimation. So I just kind of stuck with that. And what these are, I make five animations a month. They’re 10 to 15 seconds long because of what Instagram used to have as their rule of only playing 15 seconds. Now it’s up to like 60. But I don’t think, I think that’s annoying. If someone has a 60 second video
Lee Matthew Jackson:
on Instagram, you can’t say it in 15 seconds. Probably not worth it anyway.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah. And I think if you, if you give your client base a tip that’s relevant to them or a laugh or something that gives them value, then it makes them pay attention. And so I created a service where we create five videos a month. They’re 10 to 15 seconds long. You pay 47 bucks a month to subscribe. And I think I’m going to actually expand the model a bit where if they don’t want to do the monthly, they could pay 57 bucks for a one time shot just to get the five videos each month. Like you know, so this month I’d be like to buy this month’s videos, it’s 57 bucks and that’s it. Or you could do a subscription where you’re paying less and it’s just around the environment of people who buy from you and it tells them about web Design and you know, it tells them about marketing, it gives them of your iPhone.
Mike Doyle:
Do you know you could do this on it? Or they’re like, holy crap, I didn’t know I could do that. You know, so just these little fun tidbits that kind of give you something to market with when you’re out developing websites for clients or marketing plans. And you’re like, crap, I haven’t even marketed myself. It’s like, oh, I have these five videos. Let me launch one a week or one a day on my Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, social media.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
They’re really cool actually. And because you’ve specifically niched down to kind of online marketing and especially to our industry with regards to web developers, etc. They’re very useful, but they’re reusable as well. So I’ve subscribed, I’ve been a subscriber for a couple of months and one of my favorites is where you show, it’s a very simple animation, I think it’s about nine seconds long and you show a website, it says your website on desktop and it’s just this nice looking kind of block representation of a website. But then it’s. Then it shrinks down and says your website on a mobile and it really hammers home literally within a few seconds that even though your website looks really amazing on a desktop, it suddenly looks really small and inaccessible on a mobile device. And you really need to get in touch with us. We can help you with this, you know, responsive, you know, responsive design, responsive builds, etc.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
And that’s a perfect message for any web designer or design agency. So that’s, that’s one of my favorites. But you’ve also got things in there as well, like you know, how to set up a Facebook ad campaign which you can share with your clients as well because your clients are more than likely going to be asking for stuff like that. And that’s just a, you know, it’s not a very long video. Very quick and easy. Here you go. How it’s the Facebook ad campaign, isn’t it, that I’m thinking of? Yeah, yeah, yeah, you’ve got that one. But then like you said, also things like the, the iPhone tips I think are quite cool because they’ve got the potential to become quite viral.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
You know, who knew you could actually just swipe, I think it’s left or something to undelete an email on your iPhone. And that’s something you could share on Facebook as well that people would probably reshare as. Ah, this is a flipping useful tip, etc. So it’s a great idea if you want to go and check that out. That’s [email protected] EPIC. Like Mike said, it’s currently £47amonth. But if you keep your eye on or reach out to. To Mike, like you said, he may be doing that $57 for a shot, a one shot of a month if there’s some particular videos you want to get your hands on.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
And again, it’s definitely great value. I remember coming to you a while back, just kind of finding out what the price of animation would be. I think I might have come with a preconception that, like you said, it was going to be a few hundred bucks, but it’s literally not. There’s a lot of thought process in there. So I feel quite lucky, really, to be able to get this sort of animation for such a low fee. So, guys, sorry if this sounds like an infomercial, but I’m just really excited by. By this. I’ve never seen anything like this and I’ve currently got now eight videos that I’m using two months, and I’ve got eight videos that I’m able to use via Twitter, etc.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
But also to educate clients as well. So it’s a pretty cool thing, so.
Mike Doyle:
Well, yeah. And actually the way. Yeah, and you had mentioned earlier, I have it broken down even further where I just do one or two animations a month that are free. And I think that’s how you initially got into it.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
That’s exactly how I got into it.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah. I mean, once I started that, I noticed that my email list just started exploding. I’m like, all right, I’m onto something here. And the cool thing with that is I’ll reach out to the list too and say, hey, guys, I’m doing these. What would benefit you better? And it opens up this really casual dialogue. And every time I send an email like that out, I get like a 70 or 60, 70% response rate from people just emailing me back, which shows that people trust me, they’re getting value and they’re super comfortable with talking to me. And I have never, ever seen that on any email list. I’ve grown before because everything else is so.
Mike Doyle:
There’s such a wall and it’s so business. And with this, I have such a casual approach that people feel that they’re like, hey, dude, yeah, this is awesome. This, I loved this, but this could be helpful. And it helps me tailor these more. So as I’m growing this, I can be, you Know guys, I hear a lot about what you’re talking about and I’ve seen a common thread is this. So I made a couple animations this month that are doing this and it’s going to help you much better. So yeah, like the free one is great because it gets more people in and then they get limited ones and then the 47 bucks they get the five and you know, it’s so it’s like kind of grows it and then within that some people reach out and they’re like, alright, I want a custom animation. And then they’re like, we have a bigger agency, we have a budget, let’s talk about that.
Mike Doyle:
So it’s pretty cool going from no $0 to a big budget.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
You know, it’s a real good way and it’s kind of that model, isn’t it? Of give as gain. You’re offering something of extreme value. You’re building up that trust as well. In fact, you know, you said you’ve sent emails out and people have replied. I remember myself replying probably six months ago to one of your emails and I think it was just a casual one liner with cheers at the end, like we were best buddies, you know, we do know each other obviously through, through the different groups that we’ve been in. I think you mentioned the entrepreneur group as well. I think we’re probably both in that. Probably over a year ago or so.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Or maybe two years ago. Actually it’s been two or three years now, hasn’t it? Crap. That was a long time ago.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, I ended up leaving that.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Yeah, I never finished it.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, I finished the program but I just left the Facebook group. So I was like, this is so annoying.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
So many people validating and trying to sell again.
Mike Doyle:
People were just dicks. I was like, screw this.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Oh, I think I need to hug you again.
Mike Doyle:
That’s why we did the Entrepreneur Roundtable. I think that’s where a lot of people started going because they felt it was a lot safer there and they could be more get a lot of value out of that.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
It’s so good. Yeah, Entrepreneurs Roundtable. I’ll pop a link into that as well. So that’s how me and Mike met. Quite a while back I was added to a group, Entrepreneurs Roundtable. And it’s just kind of a no agenda, as it were, place where entrepreneurs can just talk. And I’ve actually found suppliers, I found business through it. I found four podcast guests through it, Mike Doyle being one of them.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
You know, it’s such a great group and yeah, there’s that kind of safety in there, isn’t there? We’re all kind of buddied up now, aren’t we? And, oh, yeah, looking out for each other. It’s great.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, there’s a lot of. A lot of connections were made to there and a lot of people got business or like you said, they needed someone to go in on a project with or they needed them to do a project for them. Like, I’ve hired Kathryn. She’s in the group. I hired her for copywriting. I’ve hired Morgan for doing some landing pages and some, like, funnels and things like that. Nick Berry has this really awesome. Is it print service where he does like, thank you or just handwritten letters or handwritten envelopes to local businesses? And it’s called.
Mike Doyle:
I forget what he’s calling it now. I suck.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
I will put a link to that as well, because that’s a pretty cool idea as well, especially for us. Side.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah, it’s just there’s some amazing stuff. And then we all banter with each other behind the scenes all the time. And any. You know, it’s like Gideon Walker, I reached out to him all the time, like, dude, I need this question on emails. And then Jared, I’m like, dude, like, you know how it has life, you know, it’s just. It’s all personal stuff. So. Yeah, it’s.
Mike Doyle:
It’s a cool.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
In fact, Gideon just did some work for me as well, just analyzing one of my funnels and giving me a whole lot of advice as well. So that’s awesome. Great guy. So. And obviously Sarah Moore as well, who everyone knows, they’ve heard her. She’s actually been a guest twice on this podcast.
Mike Doyle:
Sarah’s great.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
She does all the social media as well for us guys, which is great. She’s. She’s just nailing that.
Mike Doyle:
So I think I like about Sarah is she’s just purely genuine.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Exactly.
Mike Doyle:
You know, and the way that she teaches people how to be on social media is just how she. Like, if you watch her Twitter feed or anything, she just thanks everybody because she’s just that excited that people are sharing her stuff and she’s like, oh, my God, that was so nice of you. It’s not sure there’s some tactics involved, but I think that goes. I think first as she’s genuinely like, that was so nice.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
She’s hot on a sleeve girl.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah. Oh, 1,000%. Yeah.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Yeah. So, mate, I mean, we sound like old buddies catching up. This is great. I’m loving it.
Mike Doyle:
I know.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
I don’t want it to end, but I guess it will have to. I kind of try and keep it to 30 to 40 minutes because of people’s commute, etc. So what we normally do at this point is we wrap up with kind of one sage piece of wisdom that you’ve gleaned from your life. Something simple that you think that people could apply to their business today. So it’s just one thing, either a piece of advice, a positive quote or something that you think will, you know, if people take action on that will really start to make a difference or be kind of a pivotal moment in their business. So is there anything like that you could share a one liner or something along those lines and then we’ll learn how to connect with you and we’ll wrap up over to you.
Mike Doyle:
I think that the best advice I can give, and I still kind of struggle with a little bit, is know exactly who your target market is. It just know who that person is because there’s other people that make up that, you know, they call it the avatar of that person because if they’re going to buy it, other people like them are going to buy it as well. So again, I go back to being in a band. When you’re in a band, you are creating a product that is however you want it to be. You could be in a metal band and you will attract people that like aggression, but they also are outcasts, they like to wear black, they like long hair. And if you go to their shows, you’ll see that everyone there most likely looks the same. If you’re an emo sad band, then most likely everyone there is dressed like a hipster. If you are Taylor Swift, then the most likely the demographic are young crowd, you know.
Mike Doyle:
So you’ll see that in the room of music that it is attracting certain people and they will talk about your stuff, they’ll share it, they’ll love it, and you can they buy this stuff because the message you’re putting out is what they believe in and it helps them. So music helps you get through your day or gives you a smile or makes you feel a certain way. And I think your product, whatever you’re making, it’s doing the same thing for a certain audience. So if you find out who that audience is, however your messaging is to talk about what you’re giving them, it’s gonna make your life so much easier and you’re not going to bang your head so much like how do I make a funnel? How do I market? How does. Because if you’re like if you just know how to talk to that person, it’s just text on a paper. Then you can give it to someone to do your website or your marketing or make it look pretty. But you’re saying the same thing, just in a prettier way. But it all comes down to your message.
Mike Doyle:
Who are you helping? How are you helping them? What do they look like? So figure that out and your life will be so much, so much better as a business owner.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
And that would as well kind of permeate into every area of life. When you’re at a networking meeting, you no longer need to umm and ah, for those 60 seconds because you know exactly who you help, how you help them, you know what your message is. That consistency, mate, that’s such awesome advice. So thank you so much. What are the best ways of connecting with you, buddy? Obviously drive80.com Are you anywhere on social media that people can tweet at you?
Mike Doyle:
Yes, they are. Yes they are. Yes, I am actually. I’m pulling up because I always forget this stuff actually. Yeah, if you just go on Twitter, just go Themike Doyle. That’s the best way to contact me on there. If you’re on Facebook, it’s just facebook.com drive 80D R I V E 80. If you want to just email me and just ask me any questions, it’s mikerive80.com Instagram Themike Doyle.
Mike Doyle:
Pretty much the only places that I live. Twitter. I really don’t even go on it. Like I know I should but I just haven’t found out how to make it. I haven’t found out how to do my voice through there. So it’s better to talk to me personally than through the business because that’s just. I am my business. My business is me.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
So awesome, mate. Thanks so much for your time. It’s been fantastic. We’ll get all of those in the show notes. Your email as well. That’s awesome. And he’s great. He answers pretty quickly as well, which is cool.
Mike Doyle:
Yeah.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
It’s probably not just putting it out for the, for the sake of it. He really does, he does answer. He’s a great guy and add so much value. Mate, thanks so much for your time. Have an awesome day, buddy.
Mike Doyle:
Thanks, man. Thanks. Thank you so much for having me on here. This is awesome. So much fun.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Fun has been all mine, mate. Take care.
Mike Doyle:
All right, man.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
Now you know that I wasn’t even
Lee Matthew Jackson:
lying about how awesome that episode was gonna be. I had so much fun chatting with Mike. I really appreciate him being on the show and just unpacking his story and giving us all of that knowledge. Now, I’m super excited for next week. We’ve got someone very different, Heather Haven, which he’s not from a WordPress background, but she is from a sales background where she has been in the real estate industry. And I’m telling you what, the parallels between the real estate industry and the industry we are in are freaking phenomenal. She knocked me for six. My mouth was open at many occasions.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
I was nearly speechless, which is rare for me. So this episode coming up next week, that’s next Next Monday, episode 23 is one not to be missed, where she teaches us how to become better at sales, you know, how to close a deal, all sorts of amazing things. So that’ll be episode 23 coming up next week with Heather Havenwood. Thanks so much for listening. Don’t forget to come and meet us over at the Facebook group, leejacksondev.com group. That’ll redirect you or tap in WP Innovator into Facebook. Facebook. And that’ll come right up for you.
Lee Matthew Jackson:
And until next week, don’t forget to keep innovating.
